In yesterday’s post, Seth Resler addressed radio’s complicated relationship with podcasting. At Podcast Movement, we brought radio people together with podcasters for an entire day’s worth of sessions.
In the same room was veteran broadcaster Dave Beasing. A long-time Jacobs Media consultant, Dave is now Program Director of 100.3 
The Sound (KSWD/Entercom) in Los Angeles. Dave is a fan of podcasting and was eager to learn at Podcast Movement. He’s a great listener, and picked up on some of the key trends during our sessions.
While not a substitute for being there yourself, here’s his “take” from our “Broadcasters Meet Podcasters” sessions. BTW we hope to see you next year for Podcast Movement 18 in Philadelphia. – FJ
“Useful takeaways?” Useful to whom, you may ask. To ME! And maybe other experienced radio executives will find these points helpful, too.
Here are the 10 things that stood out to me:
1. Driving Listeners from On-Air to Pods? Not so easy.
At the Jacobs Media Strategies “Broadcasters Meet Podcasters” sessions, KCRW President Jennifer Ferro noted they haven’t had much success driving traffic to podcasts using on-air promotion. It helps awareness, she says, but is less effective than promoting podcasts on other podcasts. The radio experience is more passive, one button, often in the car where people are avoiding distractions. When they’re listening in the digital space, they’re more willing to jump around among digital offerings.
2. Social Media Does Drive Traffic to Podcasts.
That’s the experience of a Canadian broadcaster with whom I talked. They use software that makes it easy to edit the on-air product into podcast form, then post it. A relevant static photo is displayed, and Facebook treats the file just like video.
3. Talent Matters More than the Idea.
Dean Cappello of WNYC Studios said to “put the talent at the center…” rather than start with an idea or topic, then cast a show. In hiexperience helping create great podcasts like “Radiolab” and “2 Dope Queens,” it’s more effective to start with amazing compelling talent and grow the show/podcast outward from there.
4. Some Successful Radio People have the Skills for Podcasting. (Many do not.)
More Dean Cappello: For radio people to make the transition to podcasting, they have to be able to think critically, blow up an idea and put it back together. Question what you know about radio and whether it applies.
5. Podcasts Vs. Broadcasts: You’ll never be bigger than at the beginning.
“A so-so podcast with a strong open is better than a great podcast with a so-so open,” according to Tamar Charney of NPR One, because 25-50% of podcast listeners drop out in the first five minutes. Or as Mike Carruthers of the “Something You Should Know” podcast put it, “Broadcasting is in-progress. Podcasting is start-to-finish.”
6. Respect Their Time.
More advice from Tamara Charney: When editing on-air down to a podcast, don’t include everything. Only include the best stuff.
7. Branded Podcasts are an Opportunity for Local Radio.
Radio people appeared to show interest in branded podcasts – entire on-demand programs that could be produced by a station and sponsored by advertisers, who then purchase a schedule to promote them. WLNK/Charlotte’s Sheri Lynch (of “Bob & Sheri” fame) discussed the “Her Money” podcast, a prime example that she co-hosts with a client who is a financial planner. Nothing Sheri does could ever NOT be entertaining, and the client does a respectable job of keeping up with her.
8. Financial & Sports = $
“Nobody is selling podcasts on a CPM basis,” according to John Rosso of Triton Digital. Therefore, he said, 2 categories that typically sell easily without CPM are financial and sports.
9. Every Podcast Needs a P&L.
Every podcast in Dean Cappello’s WNYC portfolio has a business plan. Build in costs, lead time, plan for sponsorship money and (hopefully) ancillary revenue (book deals, syndication, video?), and follow the plan. If a podcast isn’t growing or otherwise important, Cappello said to “clear it out of the pipeline.”
10. This is Happening Quickly!
The four members of the Jacobs panel on monetizing podcasts (pictured above) were asked to predict, “What year will the 12+ podcast audience surpass the 12+ radio audience?” Their answers: 2020 (van Mosel), 2025 (Rosso), 2024 (McCracken), 2020 (Walch).
Final Observation
To me, Podcast Movement looked and felt like an NAB Radio convention of about 20 years ago. It was well-attended, with lots of enthusiastic, young content creators. I left Anaheim excited about the future of audio entertainment.
Dave will debut a new column – “21st Century PD” – in Radio World’s September 15 issue. Be sure to check it out.
Jacobs Media has consistently walked the walk in the digital space, providing insights and guidance through its well-read national Techsurveys.
In 2008, jacapps was launched - a mobile apps company that has designed and built more than 1,300 apps for both the Apple and Android platforms. In 2013, the DASH Conference was created - a mashup of radio and automotive, designed to foster better understanding of the "connected car" and its impact.
Along with providing the creative and intellectual direction for the company, Fred consults many of Jacobs Media's commercial and public radio clients, in addition to media brands looking to thrive in the rapidly changing tech environment.
Fred was inducted into the Radio Hall of Fame in 2018.
- Old Man, Take A Look At My Ratings - December 20, 2024
- In The World Of On-Demand Audio, How Do We Define Success? - December 19, 2024
- Scenes From The Classic Rock Highway – 2024 Edition - December 18, 2024
Excellent coverage for those of us not able to attend. It’s funny how #6 seems to be a constant in everything we do. Save the “director’s cut” for listening on your long drives to the beach! Thank you Dave (and Fred) for sharing!
We were saying #6 long before podcasting, right? But never truer. Thanks, Jack!
While I agree with most of these takeaways, having a unique view of the podcasting space from both the corporate side (ESPN) and the independent side (BlogTalkRadio), there are a few things I disagree with here. Let me go point by point.
1. Driving Listeners from On-Air to Pods? Not so easy. – Then you aren’t trying hard enough. Or you’re not willing to give up that valuable terrestrial time to promote the digital product. It HAS to become a symbiotic relationship between the radio show and the podcast. And it’s not that hard, it’s a matter of commitment to the promotion.
2. Social Media Does Drive Traffic to Podcasts. – To a degree. Larger, more ENGAGED social audiences will drive traffic. But having a large social media following does not necessarily equate to a large podcast audience. If your social strategy is just posting your latest promo for your podcast and not truly engaging with your audience, you will fail.
3. Talent Matters More than the Idea. – Again, to a degree. There are certain categories that will always have a large audience – True Crime and Sports are perfect examples. Yes, better talent with those genres will drive larger audiences, but ultimately, content is still king.
4. Some Successful Radio People have the Skills for Podcasting. (Many do not.) – Yep
5. Podcasts Vs. Broadcasts: You’ll never be bigger than at the beginning. – Yep
6. Respect Their Time. – Yes, but don’t misunderstand this to mean your podcast needs to be shorter. Your show should be as long as your content isn’t boring. Always be thinking about what makes a listener continue to listen. Similarly, what makes a new listener who doesn’t know me or care about me click the play button.
7. Branded Podcasts are an Opportunity for Local Radio. – ABSOLUTELY! Especially with local advertisers.
8. Financial & Sports = $ – I may be too close to this one, but, yeah.
9. Every Podcast Needs a P&L. – Of course
9. This is Happening Quickly! (oops looks like a typo) – It’s already happened and now it’s literally a matter of time. 2020 seems too soon, but I thought this was going to happen when this was first introduced 13 years ago. Podcasting just makes too much sense.
Jay, thanks for the considered response (and also for letting me know I botched my numbering!). These are great comments and observations. As for the cross-promotion – one-air and via social – I agree with you. It depends on the brand and the degree to which it commits to talking about podcasts. I do believe, however, the best place to cross-promote podcasts is within podcasts.
I also thought those predictions were a bit early (especially 2020), but based on the attendance and enthusiasm at Podcast Movement, you never know. Appreciate the comment.