Just when you thought public radio and podcasting were on a serious roll, KPFT/Houston programmer Ernesto Aguillar has thrown cold water over both. In fact, his recent blog post reads more like the ice bucket challenge.
I encourage you to read it here.
While public radio may be leading the league in podcast downloads and is often cited as a shining example of success in the podcast space, Aguillar sees it differently. He posits that public radio podcasting is more about repurposing existing programming in an on-demand format.
In fairness, NPR has been especially successful in producing and marketing its podcasts. A recent article in Wired points to the network’s ability to attract younger audiences while generating much-needed revenue. In fact, NPR podcasting dollars have doubled since 2014. And aren’t the poster children of radio podcasting and the shows that are energizing the space – Serial and Invisbilia – amazing examples of podcasting done right?
But Aguillar’s point is that rather than innovating with a different sound, alternative styles, and more varied content, the podcasting rule of thumb in public radio has generally been to simply make on-air programming available for podcasts, and thus, failing to take example of this experimental exciting space. He also contends that public radio content creators are disconnected from those who have been on the ground floor of the podcast movement.
He could have been talking about commercial radio, too. The difference is that at least public radio podcasts are being accessed at a record rate. NPR and its various shows and programs have held leading positions in the podcasting rankers, year after year.
But the lost opportunity in podcasting for broadcast radio – commercial and public – may be the inability to create fresh programming that isn’t already on the air; on-demand content that sounds different from the norm, and that connects with audiences who may not be enamored with or who aren’t spending much time listening to broadcast radio.
When you consider how commercial radio has approached podcasting, it essentially falls into the pattern that Aguillar talks about in his article. Simply posting hour #2 of the The Z Morning Crew may make it more convenient for fans of that show to access it on-demand, but it does little to expand listenership and engage consumers.
In many ways, the podcasting conundrum is eerily similar to what has played out with streaming in the broadcast world. Rather than envisioning streaming audio as the chance to try different approaches, alternative programming, new business models, and some much-needed experimentation, most streams are simply simulcasts of what’s already on the air.
The Wired article notes that the hot podcasting sector is attracting independent producers who are already invading this sector. As has been the case with streams and connected cars, there’s a hole in the fence inviting anyone and everyone to try their hand at creating content.
So for broadcast radio, podcasting is looking like déjà vu all over again. Amplifi Media’s Steve Goldstein said it best in a recent “Blogstein” post:
“Shoving content on a new platform is a lazy wish. Each medium requires a different content focus, approach and calibration.”
Radio could do so much better. Behind the scenes content, different styles of programming, a deeper dive into talent and who they are as people are all part of a podcasting content strategy that holds great promise for radio broadcasters. Simply presenting the same warmed over programming in accessible, bite-sized segments fails to live up to the true potential of podcasting.
Working with personalities, teams, and shows to reimagine this space, and what it could offer audiences and brands goes to the heart of rethinking this burgeoning opportunity.
NPR has used its savvy digital team and its vision to make amazing progress with podcasting over the past decade. Now that on-demand radio is becoming an established content avenue, the bar has been raised.
As broadcast television has learned, content creation in the on-demand format has invited some unlikely players. To think this space would be led by a company whose business model was once about sending DVDs through snail mail in little red p0uches speaks to the notion that the next big radio podcast could come from an unusual suspect.
Podcasting is one boat that broadcasters can’t afford to miss.
Jacobs Media has consistently walked the walk in the digital space, providing insights and guidance through its well-read national Techsurveys.
In 2008, jacapps was launched - a mobile apps company that has designed and built more than 1,300 apps for both the Apple and Android platforms. In 2013, the DASH Conference was created - a mashup of radio and automotive, designed to foster better understanding of the "connected car" and its impact.
Along with providing the creative and intellectual direction for the company, Fred consults many of Jacobs Media's commercial and public radio clients, in addition to media brands looking to thrive in the rapidly changing tech environment.
Fred was inducted into the Radio Hall of Fame in 2018.
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What does it say about the competence of many commercial broadcasters when they still seem so clueless about monetizing streaming and podcasting?
That the industry needs to take a deep look at itself, especially at a time when revenue generation is challenged. These other outlets provide opportunity to grow brands, participate in exciting new spaces, AND make money. Thanks, Dimitri.
There appears to be no way for commercial broadcasters to make real money from podcasting. This is no different than the mistake print made when they put subscribers’ content up on the Internet for free. Subscribers dropped their subscriptions and just read the news articles for free on the Internet. By basically giving our content away for free, on demand, we are allowing our listeners to get our content without being compensated for it. We are also doing our advertisers who advertise during our live shows a disservice. We are enabling listeners to not listen to our commercials. it is also easy to say that we should just create additional, unique content for the podcast. If the content is good enough to put up on the Internet, we should just put it on the air and sell commercials around it. Our on air talent only has so much time and effort to devote to creation of content,
Scott, you outline some of the tough choices that broadcasters face with many digital touch points, from streaming to podcasts. Ultimately, popular blogs are monetizable as NPR has proved. Perhaps the key is to create content that isn’t right for the air or for formats where long-form talk just doesn’t work. Again, some difficult decisions but I like to believe that with strong strategies and planning, it can be done. Thanks for taking the time to comment.
I am a big fan of podcasts — both original content and re-purposed content. I can’t listen to the radio all day, so I like the on-demand aspect. I also loved the specific topic podcasts that NPR used to produce (their pop culture podcast and their tech podcast), but have since discontinued due to NPROne. I am happy to see the offerings grow and I think there is space for many more. Thanks for writing about this topic.
And there’s more to come. Thanks, Sarah, for taking the time to comment.
Good insights as always, Fred, but the statement that “simply presenting the same warmed over programming in accessible, bite-sized segments fails to live up to the true potential of podcasting” sells short the fact that we had more than 450,000 audio content downloads last month at our local news and sports websites. And we’re testing a monetization model that will unlock six figure revenues against it. So the point here is that when you create really good, exclusive and compelling core content, there’s no shame in making it available on demand. And when you can monetize that without the resource investment and risk potential of creating original, unproven content, it has to be a top priority. This is not to say that we’re uninspired by the chance to “reimagine the (podcasting) space.” Guess we’ll just frame it as “the genius of the AND…” Keep your thought provoking – and industry improving – posts coming…
Jim, that’s right and I may have been “painting” with too wide a brush. Different brands are going to come up with the solution that fits and works for them, as you’ve done in Phoenix. I’m looking at the broader space and potential that podcasting holds, and hope that radio pushes harder. Thanks for the kind words and for reading our blog.
Yes, NPR slings broadcast programs online as podcasts. I listen to On The Media, and it’s strange and a little lazy hearing the furniture of a radio show in there:
“Next, we’ll hear from a man with a typewriter. This is On The Media, from NPR. [plinky plonky jazz fades] [gap] This is On The Media, I’m Brook Gladstone, now – a man with a typewriter”
But NPR’s “NPR One” product is the direct opposite of that – taking public radio and producing something truly interactive with it. I talk a lot about “atomising” (smashing your hour-long talk radio shows up into segments, with appropriate metadata) and “lego-bricking” (taking those small segments and assembling something personalised and new). NPR One does both – AND it’s feeding back data to broadcasters, to help them write better cues and stories.
NPR One proves that the broadcaster is capable of so much more. Which is why I feel that pointing the finger at NPR is in the wrong direction.
Point it at Apple, who are spending bucketloads of cash on a non-interactive linear stream destined for the most interactive device in your pocket. Point it at the BBC. Point it at lazy “best of” compilations from commercial stations. But don’t point it at NPR.
Insightful post as ever, Fred.
Thanks as always, James. I thought Ernesto was tough on NPR and said so. And as you know, the NPR One app has been a favorite in this space to the point where someone asked me why I always write about it. NPR (and other public radio producers) have shown the way for all of broadcasting. And the potential is there to aim even higher.
Thanks so much for taking the time to read and comment.
NPR’s innovation or lack thereof not withstanding, Ernesto makes a good point regarding original podcast content. Traditional broadcast radio produces some great shows that transition nicely to on demand listening but the truth is currently there are not enough of those shows. Is that because they aren’t being promoted properly? Or produced in a way that is not conducive to on demand audio as it is currently accepted? Those are certainly factors. The truth is whether it is one of the large radio ownership groups or NPR the world of podcasting and on demand listening are an alien world to most – listeners included. Radio boasts about the ability to be “local” as one of it’s greatest assets but the most popular podcasts, Serial in particular, are national. The winning combination, in my mind at least, is to offer up a combination of local oriented and national content, stuff that has such wide appeal that anyone in demo would be interested in hearing it. For example an AC station could have a “behind the scenes” of the morning show podcast but also offer a podcast of longer form celebrity interviews with Ryan Seacrest, Billy Bush, etc. Similarly a classic rock station could produce a long form “Behind the Music” style series about national artists they play terrestrially that would be of interest to their local listeners but also bring in people from outside the market as well. An urban formatted station could do something similar with local acts in the market which would be most appealing to local listeners. The point is the on demand audio world has to be treated like what it is and that is a new product, not a quick way to make a buck by doing the same thing online that is done over the air. A radio show that is also broadcast on TV adjusts to work in both mediums and this is the same situation. And while radio must leverage the content it already produces, that content needs to be tweaked to fit the format, and the existing content must be paired with ground breaking, format appropriate, products to not only hold the interest of listeners but keep them coming back to hear what is new.
Thank you for another insightful blog Fred.
Sean, you hit on some key points about the challenge of podcasting. The space requires a new set of strategies, and you bring up good examples of how stations/personalities might approach creating original content for the podcasting space. The reality is that on-demand audio/radio could be a great place to build brands and make money. But rehashing the existing material to just create convenient podcasts fails to realize the potential. Thanks for taking the time to comment.
Great insights, Fred. Currently, a virtual Berlin Wall exists between pub radio and commercial broadcasters. Podcasting presents a great opportunity for “both sides” to learn from the other. My tastes include both. Our new How Do We Fix It? (Just launched) is an example.
I will check it out, Richard. Thanks for the comment and the insight.
Gang, you’re just not getting it. Find the niche content that might not fit your regular format, but that your talent is passionate about, and turn them loose to create a podcast series that you can promote on-air and bring in new clients. Look for topics that are of interest in your market…example, let’s say you work in a market with a lot of hunting and fishing enthusiasts, and you have an on-air person who spends more time talking about his/her weekend adventure on the morning show than you (or your consultant) would like. Tell them to figure out a podcast format that works, and get the local outdoor outfitter to sponsor it (and cut your talent in for part of the deal). That client might not be able to afford a regular schedule on your station, but might well shell out money to advertise on a podcast that reaches their target audience (pun intended). If you’re lucky…your group might be able to start promoting it across regional markets and you pick up a Bass Pro Shops/Cabela’s etc. type sponsor.
Trust me…it works. I spent almost 3 decades in radio/TV news, and started producing a podcast series for fun 10 years ago this November. It’s now our family’s full-time business.
Mark Gillespie
http://www.whiskycast.com
Mark, thanks for chiming in. You were one of the first podcasters we met when we launched jacapps. As a former TV anchor, your transition to digital is impressive. And its reminiscent of our blog post on Jerry Seinfeld’s transition to streaming video. Thanks for the insights and for commenting.